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A very old Establishment down the Skulls head yard.
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A very old Establishment down the Skulls head yard.
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 13:19:31. Goto attachments  


Move over Indiana Jones ha ha Wink

During a visit to town this week finding myself with an hour to kill, I thought i'd try my luck at having a look down the yard behind the old Crown & fleece that also leads to the back of the first White Cloth hall.
The yard is now gated off with no access to Joe public, so I had a look through the window of the shop to gauge the reaction of the girl behind the food counter if I went in and said 'Hi. you don't know me but i'm phill.d of the L.H.E.S, investigator of all things strange and curious. I wonder if I can have a nosey around your back passage please' Wink
After I presented my card & explained the building used to be a pub called the Crown & Fleece which was reputedly haunted by the ghosts of 2 army recruits who suffocated in the hay loft, and there used to be 2 skulls carved on the wall marking the occasion. The girl thinking I was quite mad very nicely opened up the gate into the skulls head yard for me.        
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 13:21:06. Goto attachments  


There is some debate about what the Crown sign is. Some same it was from the Crown fisheries it used to be and some say it is advertising Crown wallpaper from when it was a decorators shop.
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 13:22:01. Goto attachments  


This is the normally locked gate leading down the yard, The Crown & Fleece is on the right and can be examined as you walk by easy enough. There is no trace of any signs were the carved skulls used to be here. In the book Haunted Leeds it has a picture of the skulls and says there were past the gate & had been removed years ago, seemingly no one knows what happened to them.        
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 13:25:00. Goto attachments  


Any trace were the skulls were would have been covered over by the cement rendering perhaps?
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 13:29:24. Goto attachments  


Is that my eyes playing tricks of does the area marked in blue look like the remains of a face in the cement render? click the picture to view it large. I can't tell.    
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 13:33:33. Goto attachments  


This is the next building down and no trace of the skulls.
Away from the hustle and bustle we step back in time to how it was 150years ago.
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 13:35:48. Goto attachments  


I love to get away from the pedestrian areas of Leeds. Briggate and Lands lane and look down the old yards & alleys. Leeds is famous for them, even Morrisey of the Smiths fame sang about them in the song 'Panic'
This is the end of the alley with no sign of were the skulls were on any of the buildings, around the corner is the rear of the White Cloth hall.    
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 13:36:52. Goto attachments  


Believe it or not this is actually one of Leeds most historically important buildings!
It was opened in 1711 as the first White Cloth hall, and was built as a direct response to the building of a covered cloth hall by the merchants of Wakefield to try entice traders away from Leeds.
The building has been allowed to stand derelict and supported by scaffolding for as long as I can remember. Despite it been a grade 2 listed building, It has now been condemned by the structural engineers and faces demolition.
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 13:38:42. Goto attachments  


Kirkgate one of the oldest streets in Leeds. Further down here in Leeds gory past It used to be called Gallowgate for very good reason. I say bring back public flogging myself lol Wink    
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 13:39:50. Goto attachments  


Poor shot taking over the top of the hoarding along the alleyway to the gated entrance that leads to the skulls head yard. I like the look of the blue advertising hoardings in the bottom of the picture. Who knows what delights they were selling from what bygone era?

Two-thirds of the most important historic building in Leeds is to be demolished. Despite its tremendous importance the first White Cloth Hall in Kirkgate has stood growing increasingly derelict for many years surrounded by scaffolding and hoardings. The Las Vegas Amusement Arcade in its eastern wing still operates but the rest of the building is getting close to state of collapse and is a health and safety hazard. It is two buildings separated by a courtyard, had fallen into such disrepair an engineer's report declared it dangerous. Archaeological examinations found owners throughout the centuries had tampered with the structure, leaving very little of the original fabric in salvageable condition.    
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 13:41:43. Goto attachments  


This ones especially for Simonn. I know he'll love this!!
A very old Manchester establishment is once again proudly on display in Leeds. I'd be interested to hear if anyone can recall what this shop sold and was called.    
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 13:43:45. Goto attachments  


I find these trespass signs funny. They don't really tell you to keep out Wink I wonder what this old sign used to be? Anybody actually recall these shops been open?
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 13:44:58.  


The pictures are small but you can click on them to view full size and Morriseys Panic can found here lol Regular Smiley

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AlH2oYedfk
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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compton
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 19:56:09.  


Phill_d wrote:
There is some debate about what the Crown sign is. Some same it was from the Crown fisheries it used to be and some say it is advertising Crown wallpaper from when it was a decorators shop.

I remember it as Crown Fisheries Phill, the fisheries part of the sign is clearly missing but I assure you it was there in the past, regarding the White cloth hall, I remember a furore about its neglect and condition in the YEP a couple of decades or more ago, cheers
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compton
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 20:00:18.  


compton wrote:
Phill_d wrote:
There is some debate about what the Crown sign is. Some same it was from the Crown fisheries it used to be and some say it is advertising Crown wallpaper from when it was a decorators shop.

I remember it as Crown Fisheries Phill, the fisheries part of the sign is clearly missing but I assure you it was there in the past, regarding the White cloth hall, I remember a furore about its neglect and condition in the YEP a couple of decades or more ago, cheers

P.S. there was a crown where the alarm box is.
Rod  Top
chameleon
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 20:19:53.  


Phill_d wrote:
This ones especially for Simonn. I know he'll love this!!
A very old Manchester establishment is once again proudly on display in Leeds. I'd be interested to hear if anyone can recall what this shop sold and was called.    


I think that might be the sign I mentioned to you when you were asking about such things a few months ago, not sure you saw ti though.

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chameleon
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 20:31:04.  


Just thinking around things here Phill - clearly you made the proper approaches to gain access which were rewarded; Your visits to other buildings were access has already been made possible by others allowing you to gain access without any aggrevative action from your team does have benefits.

Once your work is in the public domain and an interest is registered by the populous, the powers that be (or owners) seem to realise that people are concerned about these sites and do something to help protect them. The old York Road Library now has very tight fitting and new steele sheeting firmly and effectively attached to all of the lower level windows and doors.

I doubt this would have happened otherwise.
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raveydavey
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 20:35:58.  


Nice pics phill, as always.

This is a neglected but busy corner of the city centre and that building has been boarded and scaffolded up for as long as I can remember - I get my hair cut a couple of doors along at The Edge (highly recommended!)

It's a shame such a historic building has been allowed to decay to the point it is in now. I wonder who owns it now?

I can remember a good few years ago (at least 10) that plans were afoot to regarenrate the whole area including that building and hoardings were put up with artistic impressions of how it would look but it came to nothing in the end.
Trust in God. But lock your car.

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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 20:40:21.  


Thanks there Chameleon. Yes this 'official permission' and awareness to the benefits of letting people see these places for a one off visit, are something I've been working very hard with some property owners on. The amount of interest generated is amazing. I try to document the places in an interesting way to show that it would be to the general public's interest to have this material available for others to see. The better credibility you get has started to open more doors for us which is good as It means less obstacles for us lol Wink
We've even got some disclaimer forms now regarding H&S issues we hope will sway a few people unsure of a visit. A lot of people are very helpful & we have a few good projects in the pipeline. All except that Town Centre Securities regarding the Merrion Centre Odeon. I can't belief there negativity Angry
            
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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chameleon
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 20:42:56.  


raveydavey wrote:
Nice pics phill, as always.

This is a neglected but busy corner of the city centre and that building has been boarded and scaffolded up for as long as I can remember - I get my hair cut a couple of doors along at The Edge (highly recommended!)

It's a shame such a historic building has been allowed to decay to the point it is in now. I wonder who owns it now?

I can remember a good few years ago (at least 10) that plans were afoot to regarenrate the whole area including that building and hoardings were put up with artistic impressions of how it would look but it came to nothing in the end.


I remember reading somewhere (might even have been here) that the Hall is now beyond redemption but that plans included the plans recreating the Hall within the new development so that its presence was not completely lost.

Not the same as the real thing, but an unusual and laudible move by the Developer perhaps.
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 20:54:14.  


raveydavey wrote:
Nice pics phill, as always.

This is a neglected but busy corner of the city centre and that building has been boarded and scaffolded up for as long as I can remember - I get my hair cut a couple of doors along at The Edge (highly recommended!)

It's a shame such a historic building has been allowed to decay to the point it is in now. I wonder who owns it now?

I can remember a good few years ago (at least 10) that plans were afoot to regarenrate the whole area including that building and hoardings were put up with artistic impressions of how it would look but it came to nothing in the end.

I seem to remember it been like this for 20 years at least. Can anyone remember the shops been open? I seem to recall there been a hardware shop around that area. That must be 30 years ago though.    
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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cnosni
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 20:55:06.  


chameleon wrote:
raveydavey wrote:
Nice pics phill, as always.

This is a neglected but busy corner of the city centre and that building has been boarded and scaffolded up for as long as I can remember - I get my hair cut a couple of doors along at The Edge (highly recommended!)

It's a shame such a historic building has been allowed to decay to the point it is in now. I wonder who owns it now?

I can remember a good few years ago (at least 10) that plans were afoot to regarenrate the whole area including that building and hoardings were put up with artistic impressions of how it would look but it came to nothing in the end.


I remember reading somewhere (might even have been here) that the Hall is now beyond redemption but that plans included the plans recreating the Hall within the new development so that its presence was not completely lost.

Not the same as the real thing, but an unusual and laudible move by the Developer perhaps.


The plans also include the renovation of all of this end of kirkgate,so it gets my backing.
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chameleon
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 21:00:41.  


Phill_d wrote:
Thanks there Chameleon. Yes this 'official permission' and awareness to the benefits of letting people see these places for a one off visit, are something I've been working very hard with some property owners on. The amount of interest generated is amazing. I try to document the places in an interesting way to show that it would be to the general public's interest to have this material available for others to see. The better credibility you get has started to open more doors for us which is good as It means less obstacles for us lol Wink
We've even got some disclaimer forms now regarding H&S issues we hope will sway a few people unsure of a visit. A lot of people are very helpful & we have a few good projects in the pipeline. All except that Town Centre Securities regarding the Merrion Centre Odeon. I can't belief there negativity Angry
            


Thanks Phill - people don't always see or realise the positive attributes of what you do - this seemed like a good example of that to show to others.

As far as the Cloth Hall goes, I've been around a (little!) few years more than you but although the parade must have been in use, my earliest memory is of closed-up frontages and then the scaffold to stop it falling down.
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cnosni
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 21:17:30.  


Phill_d wrote:
This ones especially for Simonn. I know he'll love this!!
A very old Manchester establishment is once again proudly on display in Leeds. I'd be interested to hear if anyone can recall what this shop sold and was called.    


Ha Ha Ha Ha !!!

Nearly bust a gonad at this one,dont mention Manchester to Simonm,he goes all funny since the "Sams"incident.

Bet you cant get in the courtyard of the White Hall Phil,second thoughts,dont do it,i wont have a witness to the secret!!!
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Phill_d
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# Posted on: 03-Apr-2008 21:38:17.  


cnosni wrote:
Phill_d wrote:
This ones especially for Simonn. I know he'll love this!!
A very old Manchester establishment is once again proudly on display in Leeds. I'd be interested to hear if anyone can recall what this shop sold and was called.    


Ha Ha Ha Ha !!!

Nearly bust a gonad at this one,dont mention Manchester to Simonm,he goes all funny since the "Sams"incident.

Bet you cant get in the courtyard of the White Hall Phil,second thoughts,dont do it,i wont have a witness to the secret!!!

Mate if your thinking the same thing as me about the White cloth hall playing an important part in 'The project'? Wink

Men in black coats and all that!! Shhhh Wink
        
A fool spends his entire life digging a hole for himself.
A wise man knows when it's time to stop!

(phill.d 2010)
http://flickr.com/photos/phill_dvsn/




 
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